Hi guys. Been years since I posted on this site (meaning years of trouble free GTV6 driving..), so it's great to see how it has developed. Well done Michael and all..
BUT. Last week, after parallel parking my car, I drove away to discover my steering wheel sitting at 90 degrees off centre. No other symptoms.. but I didn't test it too much as I was understandably concerned about safety. So I dropped the car off at my local steering place for them to have a look.
They are guessing that somehow, inside the steering rack, the pinion (cog) is turning on the end of the steering column (has come loose) when under load.. such as at the end of the turning range. They want to pull it out and have a look. This sounds a bit unlikely to me.. I thought perhaps the whole rack was moving (loose bolts) but they've tested this and it isn't.
Can anyone think of a more simple explanation?
Cheers,
Ben O'Brien, Sydney, Australia
Fair question.. they are all brand new! Last time I had the car serviced, they noticed some play in the steering. Assuming it was the tie-rod ends, they replaced them, along with the rack end joints (it cost me big). In hindsight, it was probably the current problem all along.
Thanks for the reply,
Cheers,
Ben
Thanks for the reply,
Cheers,
Ben
Ben,
Same thing happened to me some time ago. It was actually the rubber packed joint at the bottom of the steering column. The rubber had parted from the steel casing. Another clue was the horn stopped working when the earth link crossing the rubber joint was broken. Put it on full lock and if it keeps turning under pressure, that's most likely the problem.
David
Same thing happened to me some time ago. It was actually the rubber packed joint at the bottom of the steering column. The rubber had parted from the steel casing. Another clue was the horn stopped working when the earth link crossing the rubber joint was broken. Put it on full lock and if it keeps turning under pressure, that's most likely the problem.
David
1985 GTV6 3.0 Zender Body Kit - Red
Well done, guys. You got it exactly right! Now the question is.. where do I find a replacement for this rubber-packed joint? The blokes at the steering place could only source a second-hand unit for AUS$100.. but they would only use it as a last resort (not keen on a 20-year old part). They really want to find a new unit, or they are considering re-manufacturing a part to suit..
Any ideas?
Cheers,
Ben
Any ideas?
Cheers,
Ben
Steering
Hi Ben,
Your steering wheel is connected to the rack by two shafts coupled together. The first shaft is a long one and has the steering boss bolted to it. On the engine side of the firewall is the short shaft. This shaft incorporates the anti-vibration rubber joint as well as a small universal joint.
The perished rubber in the joint will cause the slop in the steering as you have discovered. However, it has a safety feature that prevents the two mating parts to spin more than say20-30 degrees of the steering wheel. Anotherwords, the complete failure of the rubber junction will not cause you to lose full steering. You may get an awful lot of slop but you can still get home on it!
OK what to do?
Because this is a safety issue, please get professional confirmation about this advice. It is only intended to give you a pointer.
Choice No. 1 Get an original Alfa part and have it installed. By far the preferred solution.
Choice No. 2 Get a complete steering colum from an Alfetta and install it provided it cheks out ok in the vice under some strain. You will need to get the original ignition key to go with it. This could be an interim solution while you are finding a more permanent one.
Choice No 3.Have your existing rubber joint welded up. Get ready for lots more steering vibration if you do this.
Choice No.4 There is a possibility that someone could revulconise the original part but don't hold your breath.
Last Choice, if none of the above suits, get this section of the steering assembly from a relatively younger car (any suitable donor) and have it modified to suit you car.
It is not a huge job. I had a much bigger range of problems to sort out when I fitted a power steering rack from a 75 to a Sportiva my wife has. It required shortening this shaft and new splines cut. Expensive machining but hey, the wife loves the power steer in her Sportiva!
As I said, please run the above suggestions past some qualified people first. I want to see you on these posts for while yet and not around those that go whizzing past you pulling 7 grand in fifth!! :D
MD
Your steering wheel is connected to the rack by two shafts coupled together. The first shaft is a long one and has the steering boss bolted to it. On the engine side of the firewall is the short shaft. This shaft incorporates the anti-vibration rubber joint as well as a small universal joint.
The perished rubber in the joint will cause the slop in the steering as you have discovered. However, it has a safety feature that prevents the two mating parts to spin more than say20-30 degrees of the steering wheel. Anotherwords, the complete failure of the rubber junction will not cause you to lose full steering. You may get an awful lot of slop but you can still get home on it!
OK what to do?
Because this is a safety issue, please get professional confirmation about this advice. It is only intended to give you a pointer.
Choice No. 1 Get an original Alfa part and have it installed. By far the preferred solution.
Choice No. 2 Get a complete steering colum from an Alfetta and install it provided it cheks out ok in the vice under some strain. You will need to get the original ignition key to go with it. This could be an interim solution while you are finding a more permanent one.
Choice No 3.Have your existing rubber joint welded up. Get ready for lots more steering vibration if you do this.
Choice No.4 There is a possibility that someone could revulconise the original part but don't hold your breath.
Last Choice, if none of the above suits, get this section of the steering assembly from a relatively younger car (any suitable donor) and have it modified to suit you car.
It is not a huge job. I had a much bigger range of problems to sort out when I fitted a power steering rack from a 75 to a Sportiva my wife has. It required shortening this shaft and new splines cut. Expensive machining but hey, the wife loves the power steer in her Sportiva!
As I said, please run the above suggestions past some qualified people first. I want to see you on these posts for while yet and not around those that go whizzing past you pulling 7 grand in fifth!! :D
MD
Transaxle Alfas Haul More Arse
Hi MD and Ben. I have had this problem four times(seperate GTV's) where as you said the rubber debonds from the casing . However in one case it pushed pased the safety grooves and totally lost steering. As there was no part avaliable I pushed the rubber casing(whatever you call it) back into the sleeve and welded a large washer on top so when it came loose it would not ome out. Extra safety feature. I still have nightmares about that incident. Nothing worse than having to drive at 20km/h home getting out at every turn(with a passenger) pushing the front wheels in the correct direction with minimal steering.(had to get car home- live in SA)
So when your hooter goes beware.
The main reason why rubber debonded om my GTV's is the 7j compomotive rims that came standard on these 3.0l's often leaked and this enevitably created extra stress on this casing while forcing the wheel to turn when parking.
So when your hooter goes beware.
The main reason why rubber debonded om my GTV's is the 7j compomotive rims that came standard on these 3.0l's often leaked and this enevitably created extra stress on this casing while forcing the wheel to turn when parking.
Got the same thing here now. My symptoms were the following, in order of occurence:
- Turn Signal -return after a corner didnt happen
then:
- Horn stopped
solution:
washers in between block with horn ring and switched in steering column. It worked fine but I didn't know what was ACTUALLY happing!
then, one year later (now):
- strange squeeky noises
- When steering wheel was turned it would squeek occasionally
- Sometimes other strange noises from steering column, specially when parallel parking (rattling, grinding noise)
- Eventually being able to rotate steering wheel without the wheels moving when in lock
Found out that indeed the safety has been pushed out as well. That is a full centimeter displacement of that baby. It's now at a mechanic, and I don't know how he will solve it.
If there is a *new* part available, I'll get it, no matter the cost, but, is there?
- Turn Signal -return after a corner didnt happen
then:
- Horn stopped
solution:
washers in between block with horn ring and switched in steering column. It worked fine but I didn't know what was ACTUALLY happing!
then, one year later (now):
- strange squeeky noises
- When steering wheel was turned it would squeek occasionally
- Sometimes other strange noises from steering column, specially when parallel parking (rattling, grinding noise)
- Eventually being able to rotate steering wheel without the wheels moving when in lock
Found out that indeed the safety has been pushed out as well. That is a full centimeter displacement of that baby. It's now at a mechanic, and I don't know how he will solve it.
If there is a *new* part available, I'll get it, no matter the cost, but, is there?
-
Greg Gordon
- Verde
- Posts: 1552
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 7:06 pm
Choice #3 on MD post is the way to go. No more problems ever, period. Plus it make the horn more reliable. If there is any more vibration in the steering I can't seem to feel it.
Greg Gordon www.oldebottles.com/italiancars.htm
Greg Gordon www.oldebottles.com/italiancars.htm
Seems to me as if this is a problem we will all have to face in due time. Mine is a '81, so the trouble will hit everyone in time.
Perhaps it is good for those in the know to share everything they can. Where to get a new part, if possible, and the exact way of 'welding it up'. do you ram the rubber back, do you cut it off, do you take it out, what do you weld, etcetera...
It could be quite a dangerous thing this...
Perhaps it is good for those in the know to share everything they can. Where to get a new part, if possible, and the exact way of 'welding it up'. do you ram the rubber back, do you cut it off, do you take it out, what do you weld, etcetera...
It could be quite a dangerous thing this...
Hey guys, I was caught off guard this weekend with the steering on both our 24v GTV's. The horn was still working, steering had not rotated but the handling on fast turns and heavy braking had become 'diabolical'.
After racing out to Barrys house (25km trip) at flat out pace in both GTV's with my old man, our big smiles turned to a bit of shock after discovering the rubber bush on both cars had totally perished and were ready to come out as what previosly happened a few years ago on another GTV.
I think the best way to check these 'rubber valcanised bush' is to get some one to turn the steering wheel left and right very slowly, another person holding the front wheel tight from moving, which is impossible, but will create just enough tension , while you inspect the rubber joint to see if there is any rotation. You must of course line the up with thejoint with hooter cable as you can visually see if the cable is moving relative to the housing.
I dont know how else to describe this process but once you put your head in the hood you will know what I mean.
you might find all is well and a noisy tyre rod end.
Worth checking out.
I will take pics of the repair processes whether it be welding with washes or re- valcanising with safety washes.
After racing out to Barrys house (25km trip) at flat out pace in both GTV's with my old man, our big smiles turned to a bit of shock after discovering the rubber bush on both cars had totally perished and were ready to come out as what previosly happened a few years ago on another GTV.
I think the best way to check these 'rubber valcanised bush' is to get some one to turn the steering wheel left and right very slowly, another person holding the front wheel tight from moving, which is impossible, but will create just enough tension , while you inspect the rubber joint to see if there is any rotation. You must of course line the up with thejoint with hooter cable as you can visually see if the cable is moving relative to the housing.
I dont know how else to describe this process but once you put your head in the hood you will know what I mean.
you might find all is well and a noisy tyre rod end.
Worth checking out.
I will take pics of the repair processes whether it be welding with washes or re- valcanising with safety washes.