ALFAGTV6.COM

[zambon]

I am in the process of procuring parts for an upcoming trans rebuild adventure. While I am at it I plan to go through my rear suspension. I would like to upgrade to poly bushings wherever I can, or at least I think that would be the best course of action at this point. I am also looking at the sz uniball for the dedion bushing. What poly bushings are currently available for my car? (87 verde).
I was on the phone today with a gentleman from centerline alfa and he advised me strongly against the ball, (centerline does not carry it anyway). He gave comfort and noise as his reasons. I told him that I would think things over regarding the identity of my car. I dont expect to be running on the track that much in the near future, although I would like to get as much track time as I can. I have heard that there exists a polyurathane bushing that serves the same purpose, although I dont know of the source. Any recomendations?
IAP offers many poly bushings. On their web site they list:
-Caster arms
-Watts linkage center and link set
-Sway bar center (front)
-Upper control arms

The gentleman at centerline that I spoke to advised against the poly bushings of ´other vendors´ warning that they are too ´plasticy´ or hard. Thereby creating a harsher ride. Skateboard bushings are offered in different durometer ratings depending on their respective hardnesses. I cannot glean any usefull information about the durometer ratings of any of these bushings and I wonder if anybody on this board knows how the hardnesses of bushings from various vendors compare.
Also, as I stated above, could anyone who has purchased poly bushings other than those I have already listed post their findings? That way I will replace as many of my rubber pieces as possible.

thanks
James
and I am sorry for the rambling nature of this post

[Mats]

The ones you have listed are probably Powerflex bushings, Superflex has the de-Dion bushing too.
I have that plus the watts linkage bushings on my car and it is very nice. Tight and crisp handling but no NVH problems at all (unlike just about anybody that has the bearing in the de-Dion, the one on my racecar is very noisy). I have the upper control arm bushings but I haven't yet mounted them yet, looks like I need hands about three sizes smaller them mine to do it, I'll do it while the engine is out.
I also have the rod-ends from the 105-series in the caster arm and it is glorious and I can recommend that to anyone, no NVH problems and it just transforms the front end from a vague mushy feeling to a knife edge sharpness.

[gtv11636]

Hey Mats
I have no experience with this Uniball But I'm planing on buying me one.
anyway, Greg told me the noises from the Uniball are transfered from worn CV joints and other problems in the hole rear axle but mainly CV joints, Maybe you should check it.

[Mats]

I know exactly what is making the noise and how it is transferred to my ear.

[DaveH]

I've got poly bushings on the DeDion apex and Watts linkage. Rear does feel tighter and is not harsh at all. Noise/vibration is same as before. Except: I hear a groan in certain circumstances at v low speed when the car transfers weight from front to back. I can always recreate this backing out of my driveway. I suspect the big bushing on the Watts pivot. The pivot does not rotate freely enough with the new poly bushing in there, so I am hearing the effects of 'stiction'.

I believe I've noticed the same thing on SamW's car. Sam?

[Mats]

Didn't you use the supplied copper grease?

[DaveH]

Sure did.

[gtv11636]

I know exactly what is making the noise and how it is transferred to my ear.

And what is that ? Pleas share!

[Mats]

Have you forgotten about your own thread already?

Click Me

[gtv11636]

I do remember but you did not wrote ther the reason for the noise, do you have wrong bearings, cv joints, else ?

[Greg Gordon]

This uniball vs poly bushing thing comes back every few months or so. They are both good. I have the poly bushing in my car and my dad has the uni ball in his.

When we installed the uniball in dad's GTV6 a few years ago it did cause some noise to be transmitted into the car. We replaces the axles and CV joints and it got a lot quiter. Then we replaced the wheel bearings and that eliminated what little noise was left. The car is now just as quiet as it would be with a poly bushing.

The uniball itself can not make any noise provided it's in good shape. It can't rattle because of the way it fits into the car. It also seems to last a long time having been well over 100,000 miles in my dad's car with no signs of wearing out.

If it is making noise is almost certainly transmitting sounds from worn wheel bearings, transaxle, etc. Remember essentially all the cars horsepower goes through that bearing so if there is any thing wrong aft of the rear guibo the sound will be transmitted right to that solid connection the uni ball provides.

If all of those things are ok and it's making noise it's probably because it was damaged during installation. It's a very tricky press fitting job to install it. One thing has to be heated up and another part frozen and if you don't do it just right it can be damaged which will cause it to rattle and eventually fail. Of course it comes with no instructions so I suspect a fair number of them are damaged during installation.

The Poly bushing is much easier to install and it's nearly foolproof. It's also a lot less expensive and it seems just as good for a street car.

If money is no object and you can take the time to remove the DeDion tube and properly press fit the uniball in there and everything is in good shape then get the uniball. If you are not trying to squeeze every last bit of performance out of the car, just trying to make it a nice street and occasional track car the poly bushing makes more sense to me.

Greg Gordon www.oldebottles.com/italiancars.htm

[gtv11636]

Thanks Greg!

I just hope I can install it witout any problems as I think it fits for late models and milano;s only as mine is older (1984).

I am Trying to get the best in Handling and stuff but I also want to keep the car from tearing apart, cracking etc...
I also plan on buying the complete Beninca Suspension kit wich I think would be the best for me. (btw - does anyone here have the Beninca setup on his car except Nizam ? )

The Uniball is very expensive, it cost X4 the price of the Poly bushing so that is also a bit of a problem here.

I think i'll give it a try some day soon anyway

[ALFA GTV6 GP]

Yes I have the Beninca set up on my GTV6 !
Two other set ups I have come up with on my 75's :
I have used combinations with bilstein shocks / eibach springs whiteline sway bars /uniball conections/poly bushes/ uprated torsion bars.

Koni shocks/ jamex springs/ whiteline sway bars /uniball conections/poly bushes/uprated torsion bars
whiteline coil overs / whiteline sway bars/poly bushes/original torsion bars which I think are cool !
gtv11636 What are you requirements road or race?
The ultimate setup the RS racing suspension soon to be fitted!

[gtv11636]

Did you compared all setups to each other?

well, who is the best for what type of use for your opinion ?
BTW-Do you have the complete Beninca set Up or just some of it ? Can you tell all the parts you bought and installed from Beninca ?
I knoe Beninca doesnt recommend installing a bigger size front anti roll bar, Do you have his setup with bigger anti roll bar at front or standart ?

Why do you think the RS racing kit is better ? did you compared between the two on the same car ?

Thanks for all this information
Tomer

p.s
This car is used at roads not for race tracks.

[crown2gain]

Trying to figure out where I can get all the poly bushings in one place. Does anyone sell a single kit for front/back? International-Auto.. has a mixture of poly/rubber right now. I am new to the GTV6 world, so any links/help would be appreciated.