Hi Everyone,
Can someone provide me detail
dimensions of the following :
1. Piston height
2. Wrist pin distance measured from the crown
to the bore center of the wrist pin.
3. Connecting rod lenght measured from center
to center of the big & small end of the rod
4. I.D of the big & small end including bearing.
5. Where can I get complete tech spec info of the
24V 3L engine ?
Thanks to all in advance
-
terminator
- Silver
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 9:35 am
-
terminator
- Silver
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 9:35 am
-
terminator
- Silver
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 9:35 am
Theres no need for sarcasm tectoteam. If you have
nothing useful to contribute, kindly keep unwanted
comments to yourself. The essence of a forum is to
bring people of the same interest together so that
we can share & learn from each others experiences.
BTW, it was Google search that brought me here.
nothing useful to contribute, kindly keep unwanted
comments to yourself. The essence of a forum is to
bring people of the same interest together so that
we can share & learn from each others experiences.
BTW, it was Google search that brought me here.
imo, you wasn't enough polite.terminator wrote:Theres no need for sarcasm tectoteam. If you have
nothing useful to contribute, kindly keep unwanted
comments to yourself. The essence of a forum is to
bring people of the same interest together so that
we can share & learn from each others experiences.
BTW, it was Google search that brought me here.
to learn anything from each other, we waiting the: why to know theses dimensions.
please dont comes, say hello, and put questions.
it is very intersting to know why you want to know that.probably this will help someone.
and about my contribute i know that i have all answer for you.
but in regard of all that i will wait a while for answer.
2 stroke addict
Wow, and here I thought yhat was the exact point of this board, to ask questions and share info...tectoteam wrote:
imo, you wasn't enough polite.
to learn anything from each other, we waiting the: why to know theses dimensions.
please dont comes, say hello, and put questions.
I didn't know I had to get down on my knees first...
terminator: I think your questions are a bit too "new", that's why you don't get any replies. Not many have stripped down a 24v.
It would be interesting to hear about you project though.
Too bad all the guys that actually knws something has fled the board.
Mats Strandberg
-Scuderia Rosso- Now burned to the ground...
-onemanracing.com-
-Strandberg.photography-
GTV 2000 -77 - Died in the fire.
155 V6 Sport -96 - Sold!
-Scuderia Rosso- Now burned to the ground...
-onemanracing.com-
-Strandberg.photography-
GTV 2000 -77 - Died in the fire.
155 V6 Sport -96 - Sold!
here:
I note everything for mine.
24v 3L
1 : 61.5+4.75=66.25mm
2 : 32.7+4.75=37.45mm, 32.7 to flat top of piston, and 4.75 is the heigth of the crown.
3 : 130.9mm, not false 139.8
4 : -ID small end 20.005mm +/-0.005 (inside the bushing)
-ID big end 55.5175mm +/- 0.0065 (inside the rod)
5 : few sources for this…blue print from factory sounds impossible to get, but the workshop manuals are easy to get from a friend or from alfa versus money or the easier way in peer to peer software like emule or others; just type ‘alfa’ and look for everything beetwen 50mo and more like pdf’s and workshop manual names ectect…
hope we hear more from you Terminator now...
what are you doing with all of theses
I note everything for mine.
24v 3L
1 : 61.5+4.75=66.25mm
2 : 32.7+4.75=37.45mm, 32.7 to flat top of piston, and 4.75 is the heigth of the crown.
3 : 130.9mm, not false 139.8
4 : -ID small end 20.005mm +/-0.005 (inside the bushing)
-ID big end 55.5175mm +/- 0.0065 (inside the rod)
5 : few sources for this…blue print from factory sounds impossible to get, but the workshop manuals are easy to get from a friend or from alfa versus money or the easier way in peer to peer software like emule or others; just type ‘alfa’ and look for everything beetwen 50mo and more like pdf’s and workshop manual names ectect…
hope we hear more from you Terminator now...
what are you doing with all of theses
Last edited by tectoteam on Fri Aug 12, 2005 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2 stroke addict
yeah.......Mats wrote:Wow, and here I thought yhat was the exact point of this board, to ask questions and share info...tectoteam wrote:
imo, you wasn't enough polite.
to learn anything from each other, we waiting the: why to know theses dimensions.
please dont comes, say hello, and put questions.
I didn't know I had to get down on my knees first...
yes and no.....i'm not angry at all...
2 stroke addict
-
terminator
- Silver
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 9:35 am
yeah.....yes and no...terminator wrote:Than you very much for the info tectoteam.
I think the problem we have here is a language
thing. Though we all speak English, it's not our
mother tongue & it may be that the presentation
may turn out to sound not too nice to some.
Cheers
dont worry, i'm easy....
i undrestand as well from the first to last questions and sentences...i just had a boring episode.
so, what is the monster in progress ? looking for rods that can hold 800nm and 600hp ?
2 stroke addict
-
terminator
- Silver
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 9:35 am
Hi tectoteam,
Yes you are correct but I'm doing it on a budget.
Being a project manager, I'm always under intense
pressure to keep cost down without sacrificing quality.
If you look around the import scene, there are lots of
custom parts that does not cost a bomb simply because
the volume sales & demand is so much greater which
keeps the price low. All that is needed is to find parts
that are close or slightly larger so that we can machine
it down for our application. Impossible ? Maybe & maybe
not. I already know what pistons can be use. As for the
rods, I think there's one that can be use but will have to
see it in detail.
BTW tectoteam, do you happen to know the thickness of
the rods ?
Thanks again.
Yes you are correct but I'm doing it on a budget.
Being a project manager, I'm always under intense
pressure to keep cost down without sacrificing quality.
If you look around the import scene, there are lots of
custom parts that does not cost a bomb simply because
the volume sales & demand is so much greater which
keeps the price low. All that is needed is to find parts
that are close or slightly larger so that we can machine
it down for our application. Impossible ? Maybe & maybe
not. I already know what pistons can be use. As for the
rods, I think there's one that can be use but will have to
see it in detail.
BTW tectoteam, do you happen to know the thickness of
the rods ?
Thanks again.
-
junglejustice
- Verde
- Posts: 624
- Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2004 1:19 am
- Location: Granolaville, WA
Yeah, like Mats said, not many folks here (or elsewhere) have been inside the Alfa V6 motors to date. There are particularly even less folks around who have tweaked the insides of the 24 valvers at that...
For one, I myself only started to learn much about the technical aspects of these amazing power-plants within the past year, (while working on joint-projects with the boys down in South Africa...)
One thing tectoteam, ALL V6 Alfa Romeo rods are the same length... I am having 18 rods built right now in forged steel and the exact length of the V6 Alfa rod is 130.9mm center to center of the big-end and small-end bores.
The pistons are stroke-dependent with the 2.5 liter piston built with the highest wrist-pin to top measurement at around 35mm, the 3.0 at 32mm and the 3.2 GTA piston at 30mm... We produce our 100mm Ross units that we use in our big-bore conversions with an additional 5mm to 10mm of "meat" on top (over the stock deck-heights), so that we can do a custom finish, play with compression and squish and have the flexibility to finish them with 2 or 4 valve releases - depending on the application... They run 40mm wrist-pin center to top, unfinished and 15mm from the top ring to the top of the piston – again, unfinished…
One of the questions that you may be asking yourself is "optimal bore to stroke ratio” for your project…. Conventional thinking would dictate that the 3.0 has the best numbers and that it is actually better than the 3.2 GTA ratio, (as Alfa simply kept the rod length the same...)
More modern thinking defies this rational as the GTA motor is way over-square and performs SO well - same goes for most modern high-performance motorcycle engines – over-square (and they scream in the hp per cc match-up...) Our 3.45 litre conversions (utilizing that forged aluminium alloy unit mentioned above) is even more over-square at 100mm (99.88mm to be exact) versus the stock 3.0 and 3.2 litre GTA pistons which run 93mm bore.
The width and bore of the big-end of the rods will vary depending on the clearances that you would like to run as well as the bearings that you will use (we’re going for about 2.5 to 3 thousands of an inch, or 500 to 600ths of a mm clearance to run a stock Clevite or Vandervall bearing…) Anything less and these motors WILL drag stripes on the crank (essentially pre-seize up…) Even for s stock motor being used hard… They love a lose tolerance and again depending on the application (such as a full-race, high-rev motor) the clearances should be toward the upper end of those ranges…
The 18 rods that I am having built right now for race applications has a .970 inch big-end bore and a .94 inch small-end bore… (Running a 22mm tapered wrist-pin OD inside a custom small-end bushing…) The big-end of the rod has a 55.5mm housing width.
As a side-note, the 2.5 crank has a 68mm stroke, the 3.0 crank has a 72mm stroke and the 3.2 crank has a 78mm stroke.
Hope this helps…
For one, I myself only started to learn much about the technical aspects of these amazing power-plants within the past year, (while working on joint-projects with the boys down in South Africa...)
One thing tectoteam, ALL V6 Alfa Romeo rods are the same length... I am having 18 rods built right now in forged steel and the exact length of the V6 Alfa rod is 130.9mm center to center of the big-end and small-end bores.
The pistons are stroke-dependent with the 2.5 liter piston built with the highest wrist-pin to top measurement at around 35mm, the 3.0 at 32mm and the 3.2 GTA piston at 30mm... We produce our 100mm Ross units that we use in our big-bore conversions with an additional 5mm to 10mm of "meat" on top (over the stock deck-heights), so that we can do a custom finish, play with compression and squish and have the flexibility to finish them with 2 or 4 valve releases - depending on the application... They run 40mm wrist-pin center to top, unfinished and 15mm from the top ring to the top of the piston – again, unfinished…
One of the questions that you may be asking yourself is "optimal bore to stroke ratio” for your project…. Conventional thinking would dictate that the 3.0 has the best numbers and that it is actually better than the 3.2 GTA ratio, (as Alfa simply kept the rod length the same...)
More modern thinking defies this rational as the GTA motor is way over-square and performs SO well - same goes for most modern high-performance motorcycle engines – over-square (and they scream in the hp per cc match-up...) Our 3.45 litre conversions (utilizing that forged aluminium alloy unit mentioned above) is even more over-square at 100mm (99.88mm to be exact) versus the stock 3.0 and 3.2 litre GTA pistons which run 93mm bore.
The width and bore of the big-end of the rods will vary depending on the clearances that you would like to run as well as the bearings that you will use (we’re going for about 2.5 to 3 thousands of an inch, or 500 to 600ths of a mm clearance to run a stock Clevite or Vandervall bearing…) Anything less and these motors WILL drag stripes on the crank (essentially pre-seize up…) Even for s stock motor being used hard… They love a lose tolerance and again depending on the application (such as a full-race, high-rev motor) the clearances should be toward the upper end of those ranges…
The 18 rods that I am having built right now for race applications has a .970 inch big-end bore and a .94 inch small-end bore… (Running a 22mm tapered wrist-pin OD inside a custom small-end bushing…) The big-end of the rod has a 55.5mm housing width.
As a side-note, the 2.5 crank has a 68mm stroke, the 3.0 crank has a 72mm stroke and the 3.2 crank has a 78mm stroke.
Hope this helps…
...to Alfa, or not to Alfa? That is the question...
