New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

With the oldest GTV6 nearing 40 years in service, a forum to document projects and restoration seems sensible.
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Michael
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New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:06 am

Hey guys:
Its been a long time since I've had a GTV6 to work on, I thought it high time that I start a new project.
I bought this car from Colorado, its a 'blue plate' N California car and I guess the best part is that it has no rust. Well, at least, I have not found any so far :-)
Anyway, here are some pictures:
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Michael
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:09 am

The car is impressive, for 38 years old, the panels are remarkably straight! Total miles are around 140k but not too many of those have been accrued in recent years. I bought the car with a broken stock engine. I'm not sure what is wrong with it, but the previous owner overhauled the cylinder heads and the car never ran properly afterwards. In any regard, I'm planning on installing a 3.0 liter engine sourced from a Milano back in the late 90s.
I'm working on the engine currently, just to re-seal it. I'll then install it, get the car running and figure out what else it needs.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:19 am

The front end pictures illustrate the need for some bodywork. The car has been hit in the front at some point and the front panel needs to be either straightened or replaced...
Image
Shows above is a NOS front panel I found in Australia ... its quite expensive :cry:
In any regard, once I get the car running I'll be able to get some opinions from some body shops.

I'll update this as I go, next up - getting that 3 liter engine ready to install.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by 75evo » Tue Sep 04, 2018 11:57 am

Oh hello there stranger, nice to see you back at home :D

I spoke to Rob a few months ago telling him to be on a lookout for a GTV6 for you. Good to know you now have one in hand.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Tue Sep 04, 2018 4:19 pm

Yes thanks, Rob indeed takes credit for finding this one for me :D
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by KevinR » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:01 pm

Michael that GTV looks like it's pretty good to shape to be restored . Always so much easier when it's not rotten . Look forward to watching progress. Are you going down the route of Powdercoating all suspension bits and plating all the associated bits . Good that it does not have a sun roof as those are just rust traps.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:40 am

'Restoration' somewhat oversells what I hope to accomplish, this is more of a 'get it back on the road' project. This car has no rust but it does have a bent front panel and driver side wheel arch, and has 140k+ miles on it so its never going to be a concourse winner. That is okay though because I don't want to be constrained by the need to keep it original. I'm currently working on getting my old 12v 3.0 ready to install, and its getting close. I replaced all the gaskets and seals and ended up converting to the 164 belt system using a 164 front pulley with 60-2 timing wheel and water pump. I installed a 164 crank sensor using the Verde front cover since it has the holes ready to tap. One day I want to Megasquirt this car and this will allow me to retire the distributor (or convert it to a cam sensor only).
Anyway, I used the original Verde timing belt tensioner, overhauled with new seals, but I filled the oil reservoir with grease to make it essentially a fixed tensioner. I don't exactly remember if this is all that is needed. I still have the spring installed between the sliding metal plate and the body of the tensioner (I think this sets the initial tension), but did not install the other spring. For setting the tension on the belt ... I loosened the retaining nuts & rotated the crank several times and then left the engine exactly at TDC. I then tightened the retaining nuts. I can just about twist the belt 90 degrees so it feels about right.
Any feedback on this timing belt tensioner implementation?
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by KevinR » Sat Nov 24, 2018 10:26 am

Hi Michael , I have been doing similar set up with tensioner for last 20 years and no failures ... Yet :)
I do however change the belt every four years regardless off mileage. I have never filled the tensioner with grease or stripped the spring out. I do set it with the spring compressed in the tensioner and a firm 90degree twist at tdc only and recheck after few rotations at tdc.
This is also an excellent option for not having to worry about grease and spring giving to much variance . See pic below of Oliver's engine by using small adjustable rod ends.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:46 pm

Awesome idea!
I'll duplicate this on my engine.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:22 am

Anyone know what this box does?
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This is on the passenger side firewall, just behind the dash, near the ECU.
I know the sensor for the catalytic converter was connected to it.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by 75evo » Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:30 am

Is that a cat over heat sensor circuit?
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Sun Sep 15, 2019 12:46 pm

Can anyone advise on what this is, and the wiring for it?
This box is also installed under the dash, near the ECU. It has a part number 390.101/4/3, Veglia/VDO. I think it might be the SPEEDOMETER AMPLIFIER?? Unfortunately the wires were cut and I have not been able to find a wiring diagram. Anyone know how this connects up?

There are 5 loose wires
  • Black
    Green
    White/Blue
    Pink
    Red/White
The Black, Green, White/Blue wires obviously connect to the black plug but I don't know where the Pink and the Red/White wires connect.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by MD » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:07 pm

Hi Michael
Long time between drinks. How close is this project to launch date?
To be honest, I have never seen that item on any cars I have worked on in Oz.
In terms of the wire colours and their application, the pink wire is generally a power source and the white (could be) switching or signal. The balance of the wires are known as you have indicated. The key thing that I believe is that is unlikely to be a speedometer amplifier as such a thing is provided for inside the Speedometer box itself on its own circuit board.

Could reveal itself in a reverse scenario. When you complete the "restoration" and you find one feature of the car that isn't working, that could be a pointer to what it serves. At that stage you may do a trial and error connection or simply provide a substitute solution of known function. I wouldn't let this slow down my progress.

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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by grantleyrich » Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:26 am

Hi Michael,

I have dismantled and reassembled most of the wiring under the dash of my car but have never seen a device like that before.

The only white/ red wire I have seen is from the speedo pulse generator/ sensor to the speedo. But yours is a bit heavier gauge than I would expect. On my GTV6 the sensor (in the gearbox) is wired directly to the speedo, there are two wires connecting them that are coloured pink and white/ red.

Maybe the simple answer is that the mystery box is only connected to the three wires that are in the connector, and that the pink and white/ red are the speedo supply and just happen to have been cut in the same place.

As for the mystery box, all I can suggest is that it is something that is unique to US cars, like the warning light for seat belts?

Good luck.
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Re: New GTV6 project, 1981 Rosso

Post by Michael » Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:01 pm

Thanks for the feedback.
I agree that I've not seen one of these and I have owned a few GTV6s, even an '81. It is clearly a factory part though. This is an early production car so I wonder if it was a leftover from the Alfetta generation? This car also has the ATE steel brake calipers which I think were replaced by the Brembo calipers early on. I found one of these mysterious boxes for sale here:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Alfa-Romeo-GTV ... 2111005641

It is also weird how the wires were cut, but honestly, I have found so many issues, especially 'modified' wiring that I'm not really surprised.
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