ALFAGTV6.COM

[kevin]

450 plus plus hp turbo.

[75evo]

Greg,

Met Lesfrom Oklahoma with the brown S/C GTV6 at the convention, lovely car! Loads pf power! But needs RS suspension parts badly.

Jim,

Well there is more than one way to skin a cat. I'm extending my 75's track, 25.4mm on EACH SIDE, plus I have 17x8 low offset wheels, and 235/40/17 tires. We'll see how much of an advantage the 1.8T has after this.

Met a guy with a 115 GTV turbo, told him his 2L liner may split soon hehe. Nothing like scaring a few 4-cyl folks.

[Jim K]

Understeering pigs will remain so, no matter what you do with your track, especially in tight ccts where itit will be more evident. V6 weight distribution is at a great disadvantage compared to 4cyl. Unless you can move the lump back a couple of feet... hmmm, find a brick wall at maybe 30mph? Even in the Nurburgring the V6 shows a disadvantage compared to 4cyl.
Jim K.

[75evo]

I was at the track with Larry of Alfa Parts Exchange and he said the V6 is only 45 lbs heavier than the 4-cyl. He should know, he ships and strips these all day long.

Then when you add the big azz turbo, IC, it ain't gonna be too different.

Anyway I just got back from driving a Q4, maybe it is setup wrong, but it was REALLY laggy! Everything looked stock, turbo, manifold, but there was surge at 4K and I didn't bother revving it past 6K because I know it would not be that powerful at the top. Typical of turbo cars. Bleh after 6K.

Nothing like a linear power delivery of an NA V6. I was flogging my V6 yesterday at Sonoma Raceway during the Alfa Convention and it had such a nice linear power band up to 7K rpm

[Jim K]

Yeah, well, tell that to Alfa Corse! They had 400hp@6krpm and 667Nm (484ftlbs)@5krpm in the 1.8T's and a redline of 6400rpm. No more revs needed! A na engine has to rev sky-high to do the same! Bottom line: you want a nice Sunday drive with the family, get a multicylinder big-cube pig and its gonna last you 3 lifetimes even running on half the cylinders! You want a boy-toy for corners and fun, get a turbo or SC job.
Jim K.

[Maurizio]

I'm always wondering if a sc'ed 1.8 would be able to have the same sort of powers (read 200~250 [hp]) but be more drive-able.
As a SC engine more behaves as an NA engine and would take out more the difficulty of driving it on the edge. ie Hitting the apex in a drift in case the turbo kicks in....
I'm convinced I don't have a hidden Larinni somewhere in me.

[Jim K]

Good question Maurizio, one in Greg's field of expertise. 1.8T's are good, but I hate all the heat we have to deal with. No matter how you insulate things, its still very hot under the hood! If you happen to live in ridiculous hot summer weather, it becomes even worse. An SC kit with comparable output would be very interesting! How about it Greg?
The 1.8T is almost ready for the install now, just the p/s parts missing and the ductwork which remained in the car. Hopefully next week sometime -depends on the garage- it'll come alive!
Jim K.

[Duk]

Good question Maurizio, one in Greg's field of expertise. 1.8T's are good, but I hate all the heat we have to deal with. No matter how you insulate things, its still very hot under the hood! If you happen to live in ridiculous hot summer weather, it becomes even worse. An SC kit with comparable output would be very interesting! How about it Greg?
The 1.8T is almost ready for the install now, just the p/s parts missing and the ductwork which remained in the car. Hopefully next week sometime -depends on the garage- it'll come alive!

Yeah, probably still couldn't have anything more than 4In/Hg vacuum at 2000rpm, so why bother?.....................

[75evo]

Sweet, now we have one more use for you turbo folks. Happy cooking!!!

Wouldn't want one now, it would de-laminate my CF hood

[Jim K]

Whose is that?? And why is there no blood??
CF hoods are delaminated by hot dogs?? Nice quality dude!!
Jim K.

[Greg Gordon]

I'm always wondering if a sc'ed 1.8 would be able to have the same sort of powers (read 200~250 [hp]) but be more drive-able.
As a SC engine more behaves as an NA engine and would take out more the difficulty of driving it on the edge. ie Hitting the apex in a drift in case the turbo kicks in....
I'm convinced I don't have a hidden Larinni somewhere in me.

The newest superchargers can deliver 200-250hp and be very civilized. Most people don't realize how efficient the newest units have become. I'll add a picture of my Spider with the Sprintex unit. It's running but not driving yet. My real life has really slowed down my projects and the Spider is always put behind the customer stuff.

Will it bolt up to the 1.8? I think so, looking at the pictures it appears all the same mounting points are there.

Greg

[Greg Gordon]

Oops, here is the picture

[Greg Gordon]

Compared to the old MP62 supercharger I used on the V6 and the 4cyl supercharged Milano, this thing is a huge step forward. The old blower had an adiabatic effieicnecy of about 60% through most of the RPM range with a peak of about 66%. That wasn't bad 10 years ago, and at or below 10psi a more efficient unit wouldn't help that much.

This new type has a peak of 75% and will be there most of the time. I wrote a new version of my supercharging book and updated it with data on the latest superchargers water meth, etc. Here is a chart from the book that's pretty accurate for the supercharger on this car.

To put this into perspective. At 14psi, this new supercharger has about the same discharge temps and drive power numbers that the older unit has at 10psi!

[Greg Gordon]

Greg,

Met Les from Oklahoma with the brown S/C GTV6 at the convention, lovely car! Loads pf power! But needs RS suspension parts badly.

Les' car is quick. It has the MP62 supercharger with about 9 pounds of boost, an intercooler and forged non-interference pistons. It has about 230rwhp, I think with a less restrictive exhaust (he has four mufflers on the thing) and 11psi it would be a little over 250rwhp.

The RS suspension would make it a lot faster around the track, but Les only drives it on the track a couple times a year, and the rest of the time he uses it almost daily, so I am not sure it's something he will want.

His car does have 25.4mm bars, Bilstiens, and the SZ bearing, so the suspension is upgraded to an extent.

Greg,
www.hiperformancestore.com

[Jim K]

Greg, in terms of hardware/space utilization, I can see the pictured SC kit and our std 1.8T are very close. In fact, with my air/water IC (modified/enclosed std IC) I can see switching from turbo to SC a very easy swap. Maybe we should think about working on such a pilot project. The 1.8T ducting/throttle will do just fine and the routing is very close. The only other addition would be the std 1.8/2liter exhaust manifolds or -why not- headers.
Jim K.