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Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:06 am
by 75evo
I guess not BHPs are the same. Some are draft horses and some are shetland ponies. :roll:

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:10 am
by 75evo
BTW Mats, that idea is definitely better. Maybe a ring split in 2 for ease of installation. Maybe mount it to the chassis to contain the drivehsaft when it decides to explode.

JK,

I can get access to the laser pointing device and Kev has made one up too.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:54 am
by Jim K
Thanks; I have 3-4 lying around the house -you know, those cheap pnlike things about 2" long. Make a cheap alloy 'plug' for the flywheel and lodge it in there...done!
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 12:43 am
by Mats
75evo wrote:BTW Mats, that idea is definitely better. Maybe a ring split in 2 for ease of installation. Maybe mount it to the chassis to contain the drivehsaft when it decides to explode.

JK,

I can get access to the laser pointing device and Kev has made one up too.
Actually the DR Rules states that the ring should NOT be a split one and I agree, no bolt in the world can take a beating like that.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 12:41 pm
by Jim K
After several months of hibernation, its time to raise the dead (thread) :lol: ... The 24v 3liter started up again a couple of days ago in my painted car (seam-welded in the engine bay) with only the headers on! :twisted: Monday morning it will go to the exhaust shop and it'll hopefully be done in a couple of days. Can't wait to drive around in it! If all goes well, it'll have to be mapped in a week or two. It took a long time to put things right in the engine bay. I removed all turbo related wires, relays etc and reinstalled the chassis harnesses with new sleeves, connectors, relay sockets etc. I believe it looks very tidy and proper now. I fabricated and fixed heat shields between the headers and chassis, out of aluminum sandwich cat-covers. I am happy with the wiring and very little electrical work is left to do. I was particularly happy at how easily the engine turns over with the Red Top 25 battery I have mounted under the passenger seat! I was afraid I would have to get a Red Top 30, but I was spared the expense. The engine had completed ~700km before the driveshaft broke so its time for an oil change. Unless someone has a legitimate reason to object, I'll fill it up with Valvoline VR1 10w60 or Castrol Edge 10w60. They go for ~12.5€/liter so its an expensive oil change! What the hell, this will happen only twice a year!
I haven't mounted the oil cooler yet but I'll do it soon as we have a track weekend in late April. Since this is a trackday/daily driver, the RSR coilovers will go back on.
The fiberglass hood and trunk lid is being prepared for painting so there's some weight loss. I have corner weight scales, so I'll check and see how we do. My mechanic's 75 (with this engine) weighed 1106kg -no rear seats, same fiberglass hood, no a/c. My car has the Recaro interior, no a/c and removed under-carpet insulation. I estimate ~1200kg. I'll have real numbers after the exhaust is done.
Alive again!!! :roll: But with super-unleaded going for ~1.95€ and our ever decreasing income, I don't see this car getting much use!
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:59 pm
by Giuliettaevo2
We need pictures or it didn't happen.... :twisted:

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 10:39 pm
by 75evo
And videos! Or we call up the schnitzel house at the ring and say, dont serve the dude when he goes there! :mrgreen:

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 11:55 pm
by Jim K
:lol: Bunch of blackmailing %#@*&^!!! I'll take pics when I get it back from the egg-zaust shop and I'll get one of the garage regulars to make a video.
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:50 pm
by MR2 Zig
too funny :lol:


Have fun with that thing!

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:59 am
by Jim K
Ok, the thing is back in the shop. The exhaust man did a very good job. The note is deep and quiet. The two downpipes (secondaries) are 55mm OD, they each have a flex-joint and they continue to merge into a single 63mm OD pipe and from then on there are two straight-through muflers with rear mid-bumper exit. I'll have pics tomorrow. Right from the start, there was a severe misfiring problem with the N2C plugs I had in. Hmmm, I switched to BR8ES (NGK) and no more misfire; I would prefer BPR8ES but they weren't available. My explanation is the lack of resistance caused interference problems in the ecu through the wiring. I wish that was the only issue! The main problem is I think the engine runs in 'safe mode' and can't perform at all. You can drive around but the max is ~4300rpm (std 164Q4 management). Some guys here say that unless the ecu 'sees' the cam sensor signal at exactly the right time, it'll never run right. I would expect the ecu to have some kind of time 'window' in degrees, within which the cam signal should appear. I have departed from factory timing marks, thinking different lobe centers would be better for the Williams-profile cams. When we hook up the diagnostic tester it always shows a 'cam sensor' problem, but the sensor has been replaced... Damn! Tomorrow I'll retime the cams to the exact factory settings and see what happens. My patience is fast running out! :evil:
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:22 pm
by 75evo
Did the pulley slip? Or did the timing belt skip a tooth? If the car ran fine before why did did mysteriously start missing now?

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:39 pm
by Jim K
Apparently it never ran 100% fine. It was misfiring most of the time (plugs) and proper running was experienced very few times and for brief periods -according to the guys who drove it when the engine was in the other chassis. Today I'll check all timing marks again; actually only two are important, TDC (number of teeth to crank sensor) and cam cyl 1,2,3 exhaust cam (where cam sensor is located). If I see any difference, I'll return to factory spec.
Before all this though, I'll also try another ecu since its the easiest thing to do...
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:07 pm
by Michael
Hmm - you might consider Megasquirt if the stock EMS is FUBAR. The latest version (MegaSquirt-III with the MS3X Expansion Card) can support all the 24v requirements right out of the box (no soldering or mods of any sort).
http://www.ms3efi.com/
I'm upgrading my MS2 system this weekend and will post the procedure, and the tuning file.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 7:58 am
by Jim K
Thanks Michael, may come in handy for a future upgrade. Right now I'll stay with the oem stuff since it seems to work and can be mapped.
Solved the problem today...found the cam sensor gap at ~1.9mm (spec: 0.1-1.5mm). I set it to 0.8mm by carefully knocking the pin out towards the sensor. Is the sensor shorter than it should be? :roll:
Performance is now good but some surging points to the need for mapping. This is expected, since the CR has been raised to 11.3:1, different cams are used as well as a new exhaust system.
Here are a couple of pics of the exhaust system. Both mufflers are of the oval type and the sound is very proper, contained and deep, not in the least offensive to the ear or anyone nearby. Note that the chassis is a 1st series 1.8T with the gas tank under the trunk floor next to the spare wheel well.
Jim K.

Re: JK 24v 3liter ..at last!

Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:51 pm
by squadragrunn
i would really love to hear that exhaust, maybe i'll copy it or part of it