ALFAGTV6.COM

[GarthW]

Hey guys, well as afew of you may know, i should be on the road by know...
For some reason we just cant get good ignition timing..not good enough to even try drive the car...it has taken awhile, like an extra 2 weeks to get this sorted and still no luck. The mechanic trying to tune it said he has never had a problem tuning any other ecu, where with mine it just aint working. Would it be the ecu..? or maybe just something with the dizzy..? Mechanic is away for a week, so while its sitting in a shop, i thought maybe you tech heads could shed a bit of light on this, as we seem to have hit a wall and get my baby to run. And after all time and money spent, i'll just say one thing......this isnt fair!!!!!!!

Any help greatly appreciated,thanks...

[Duk]

Have you spoken to Adaptronic about the set up? The Set Up Wizard seems pretty helpful.
Having said that, and I know it is a different system, I did read on the EMS forum (for the 4424) about a guy having trouble with the computer interfacing with Variable Reluctor trigger after a particular engine speed. That was with the 60-2 crank wheel tho.
What are you using for a trigger?
VR triggers seem to cause the most trouble in after market EFI land with Hall Effect being the most reliable, followed by optical trigger (like the Nissan 360 slot with 6 sync slots).

Maybe a swap to a Hall Effect sensor would help. http://www.hallsensors.de/Hall-GTS.htm was a link from the "I'm having trouble with my VR sensor on my 60-2 wheel with my EMS 4424" thread (sorry, couldn't find the original).

[alfagrimeparty]

Try sending your fuel injectors to www.witchhunterperformance.com they will flow test and ultrasonically clean them and have them back to you in a couple of days. Also check your fuel supply pressure and AFM. I thought I had a blown motor once and it ended up being a fuel prob. That's my advice-Ciao.

[Barry]

Garth,dont know the adaptronic at all..will Google and have a look for you.
I have a philosophy when it come to these modified cars.
Keep it real simple.
I use a dizzy with rotor and plug leads,re curve the dizzy for the turbo application and its dead reliable.
As humans we want the latest and greatest gizmo`s..
The green car ? Dizzy with the fuel computer being triggered off the coil negative !! Just like the std Jetronic !
Cheers.

[GarthW]

Thanks for help guys! Trigger i'm not sure about, but you could be onto something there...
Injectors were all sent back and have been flow tested, all ok.
Plugs to injectors were changed.

Adaptronic have been on the phone many times to the mechanic tuning it, they are at a loss why its not running well.

But Duk i think your right, will hopefully have this sorted by the weekend, but i'm not getting my hopes up...

[Duk]

I've only read good things about them from the guys that are using them over on the Toymods forum, so it is very strange to hear of trouble.
Are you using the Motronic 60-2 crank wheel and VR sensor or the distributor sensor?

If you are using a dissy sensor, what conditions are the bearings/bush's in?
ie, is there much slop that could be causing the trigger wheel to move away from/closer to the trigger sensor (I'm guessing it's a VR pick up)?

Best of luck, it's always some pissy little thing that gets in the way right near the end even on relativly simple jobs, let alone a major under taking like your's

[OzMidnight]

There's a bunch of Suzuki GTi guys making solid power using the Adaptronic setup. Some of them are fairly clued in with this ECU and aftermarket tuning. You can find them on http://www.redlinegti.com . Ignore the childish rubbish that can go on there and you may find some gems of info that you can use.

Look for guys like rvengineering and bzchi.

[GarthW]

Thanks OZ, i sent the link to the guy tuning it.

Fuel mapping issue now, what a load of shit this is!!

I've just about had enough with this now, seriously, anyone here in Melb wanna buy my car..?

Only one catch....Good luck trying to tune it!!!!

Hahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I've lost the plot...slightly...i went out and bought a little Fiat on the weekend, so the Alfa, i think is gonna go, i'm broke, i'm angry, and i have no turbo gtv6 to drive now...over $10k spent on go fast shit i cant even use.

You know the worst thing, i 'm reading about other guys cars, only 4-6month build time, etc, etc, and i still dont have mine after 14months off the road!!!!

So if anyone would like my car, the car that wont even run, make me an offer, i'm only kidding, like who would want this..? I dont even wont it!! Arrrrrrrrrrrgh. I'm out-E!

[MD]

Garth,

Let's think out of the square for a moment.

If you are prepared to get some prices to ship your car to Brisbane, I will undertake to find somebody who will tune your car for you.

Think it over.

[SimonB]

This kind of stuff is always frustrating and annoying, but machines are just machines and can always be made to work. Maybe a second opinion from someone else will just sort the problem. Beninca is in Melbourne and is world famous for example, I am sure there are others. Many people on the forum have gone through this type of thing. I am so glad that I didn't sell up a few years ago, although I am also more skint because of it. When your car is running right, it will be a legend and you will forget all about this stage.

Best of luck, whatever you decide to do...

[MD]

Simon I agree that this is generally sound advice but here is a bit of colour just for spice.

Most (not all) Alfa owners have Champagne tastes with lemonade wallets. In my case, I manage to get by on sniffing empty lemonade bottles.

I have no doubt that Beninca has the capability but the more important question is , does Garth have the Beninca invoice capability and his painful lament would suggest not. Therein lies the core problem.

Garth, send me a PM

[SimonB]

Fair enough, it all depends on the cost per hour and the number of hours and the second one is a big unknown, and I guess the first one is high. Every now and again I have had to stick the Alfa in the garage for a few months while I get the cash together to sort out the latest problem. What I found was the guys who didn't charge much per hour needed a lot more hours to sort anything out, and the car never ran properly afterwards. Going upmarket and going to Lozano in Valencia and Cardoso & Perreira in Porto actually ended up saving me money because problems were actually sorted out and thats why I still have my car. However this is probably totally irrelevant to the case here. I just sort of meant hang in there, everything can be sorted out someone must know how to make this car run properly.

[Zamani]

Garth,

Give Beninca a call and ask him for estimates. Can't be more than 2-3 hours on the dyno. Besides, no one wants a non-running Alfa. If you get it to run, it'll fetch a higher price .

[ar4me]

Can't be more than 2-3 hours on the dyno.

That probably assumes everything is put together right. If they have to trouble shoot and start correcting things, I'm sure it will go quite a bit beyond that. Besides, no shop likes to take over an "abandoned" project from another shop... Getting a quote (if they'll provide one) sounds like good advice.
Jes

[slyalfa]

I do not know that system. but I have to ask a few things.
is this a stock motor? or a newer one. that had the dizzy on the cam?
you know after x year and x SN they added oil squirters and changed the gears feeding the oil pump. so the pump spins faster. if you used one of the faster gear sets with a dizzy on that gear it will never work.
if you have a crank trigger I would just go wasted spark and not use a dizzy at all.

if it is wired right it should be easy to get going. when I did the VEMS install on mine it did not take long at all to tune myself and that was the first time for me. I think I could do it now a just a few drives now.

As for the timing I just set every thing to 0 cranked it (sparks plugs out) and used my timing light and adjusted the trigger wheel off set until the TDC mark lined up.
Then I put in my timing advance map. put in the plugs got it to fire and let the WBO2 do its thing drove a bit logging. then I just corrected the maps by looking at what the WBO2 had to do while driving. After that it was all ready better then the l-jet. Then a few more drives and the map gets real good where the wbo2 has to do almost nothing. It takes a bit more time to get the cold start set up. And some time playing with the acc enrichment to get it to have a crisp throttle response.